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Author Topic:   wheel offsets and lr bite
timaladd
Member
posted August 26, 2002 11:03 PM
i race a 3200lb camaro on 1/4 clay medium bank, 1000, 900lf, 175, 150rr. we are trying to get a better setup for tacky tracks. we won a feature 2 weeks ago on a slick track and took it home and put it on the scales, we had 180lb of lr bite with the wheels even on both sides. we took some left rear out the next next weekend and the car ran in the middle of the pack. a good racer that has given me advice in the past told me to either kick the left rear out or the right rear in. so this past weekend we pulled the rr in 2 inches( ordered a wheel to pull it in 1 inch but it didn't come in ontime) and started with 60lb lf bite as he told us to do. we got rained out sat so we ran sunday afternoon and the track was very slick. the car wouln't come off the corner. so we put lr bite in it to get off the corner and it pushed going in. my questions are: is the rr pulled in 2inches too much? will only 1 inch change this. before when we ran good on a slick track is when we put the 1000lb spring on the right front so it would turn going in(it pushed with the 1100). i am afraid the car will bottom out if i go any lower on the rf spring. i know that pulling the rr tire in helps sidebite on a tacky track( as well as kicking the lr out). do you get to a point that sidebite hurts you on a slick track? is letting the rf travel more going into a turn and unloading the lr the secret to getting a car to come off the corner( so you can run more lr to get off the corner)? thanks for any help


Dunbar
Member
posted August 28, 2002 01:00 AM
I'm just alil confused. why do you wanna bring the wheel in? The people I talk to and race with always run a 2" offset on the left rear. so why do you wanna bring the wheel in? order a 2' OFFSET wheel and stick it on and tell me what you get


outlawstock17
Member
posted August 28, 2002 07:35 AM
regardless of which corner of the car that you're working on, when you change the offset of the wheel you are changing the weight that is on that corner on the car. move the wheel out away from the body and you are lightening that corner, move the wheel in and you're adding weight to that corner.



Dunbar
Member
posted August 28, 2002 10:59 AM
Thanks for clearing me up on that outlawstock apperciate it. But I just dont see why he wants to pull the wheel in and add weight. Myself and seems like everyone else I race with has a 2" offset wheel on the left rear, just never heard of someone pulling the left rear in.But once he pulls the wheel in or out it's gonna change the weight.


jammin
Administrator
posted August 28, 2002 12:09 PM
Actually Outlaw, it works on the opposite cross wheel too. If you take weight off of the right rear, you also take weight off of the left front, then the left rear and right front gain weight. Left rear manipulates the right front as well. Take a look at the scales when you change, you will see this.

jammin


outlawstock17
Member
posted August 28, 2002 12:54 PM
well.....according to tony stewart and bobby labonte....."wider is better"...LOL

you are correct jammin. the weight has to go somewhere else or come from somewhere else. i knew that. i just didn't type it down....

[This message has been edited by outlawstock17 (edited August 28, 2002).]

outlawstock17
Member
posted August 28, 2002 01:07 PM
hey jammin, i've never tried this on the scales but if you moved the offset out away from the body on the LR and the RF at the same time, what would happen to the weights? nothing? would it add weight to the RR and LF?


jammin
Administrator
posted August 28, 2002 01:19 PM
decrease in crossweight...more weight added to the right rear and left front. Your compounding the weight difference....any time you move a tire away, loses weight on that wheel. Do it on both sides, you just multilplied the difference. Thats exactly why offsets work for fine tuning just exactly as stagger does as well. Then if you put a smaller tire on the left rear, you just loosened it up more.

jammin


outlawstock17
Member
posted August 28, 2002 01:56 PM
hey thats good stuff. thanks.


jammin
Administrator
posted August 28, 2002 02:06 PM
YW!


timaladd
Member
posted August 28, 2002 09:44 PM
i have scales and can keep the each wheel weighing the same amount, but when i kick the lr out or rr in they both provide sidebite. i have a problem on a wet track, when i put the sidebit in the car and keep the lr tracking even with the lf, the car gets too tight going in when i put the weight i need on the left rear to get off the corner. i wnat to know how much lr weight to run when i give the car sidebite( by kicking out the lr or pulling in the rr).


outlawstock17
Member
posted August 29, 2002 07:24 AM
try putting a little more air in the RR on a tacky track. that should loosen you up going in. i always stick the RR out with a 2" offset wheel when the track is tacky.


awkwardjeff
Member
posted September 07, 2002 01:47 AM
Jammin, Maybe you can help me out here...or maybe I can help you out?? people think different sometimes......I know what works for me, and You know what works for you.

Although I agree with EVERYTHING you stated as weight distribution goes with wheel off-sets ......the question had to do with tightening the car up or loosening the car ..........

If we started with a car the was square, all wheel pointing stright and inline with each other......so the TRACK of the front/rear was in line......do you believe because you space the left rear out you loosened the car?? becuase you took weight off the left rear tire???? I personally move the left rear out to tighten the car......because the TRACK of the car change has a much greater effect then moving 18 pounds.....that's what the scale tells me I move in 1 inch of off-set...........the roll axis of the car is changed along with the slip angle......

To loosen the car up on a wet track I skip the right rear out......

I think we all agree you must first get into the corner before you think about the center and getting off the corner.......some changes will tighten the car up on entry but loosen it on exit......... I think that's what my example shows.......the track of the car will tighten on entry, but loosen on exit.

I'm NOT looking to disagree or argue, I haven't been stopping by lately because i've been too busy.......I still enjoy this web-site and think it's a great learning tool. And I respect your thoughts and knowledge, that is the reason for me asking YOUR opnion on my thoughts.

Jeff

racerss10
Member
posted September 07, 2002 10:51 AM
i had my car scaled and they added weight to get the rear percentage up. but now im tight going in .i have 2" offsets all the way around how would i loosen it up a little.


jammin
Administrator
posted September 07, 2002 11:49 AM
Jeff, most of the time when I say loosen a car or tighten a car, coming off of the turns is what I am looking at. You can do just the opposite in different situations and track conditions true...if you decrease cross on a tacky track, you can tighten the car all the way around, but when it gets slick, you must go the other way. Most of the time, i tune for a relatively dry slick track, but the tracks we have run lately havent been getting dry due to the lack of cars.....so, you have to change your strategy. I hope this clarifies.

jammin


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