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Author Topic:   Ball joint question
RACEINMUD
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 323
posted March 08, 2005 10:58 AM  
Ok, Did a search, no luck. Called Day motorsports, no luck. But, I thought I read a post on here of some ball joints that will fit in a metric lower a arm and work in the impala spindle. The moog k6141 is the correct taper but to large for the a arm opening. Anyone? Thanks, Race

ss99
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 120
posted March 08, 2005 11:31 AM  
I think you're going to have to either ream the spindle or grind the a-arm depending on the ball joint you use.

istock05
Dirt Newbie

Total posts: 2
posted March 08, 2005 11:47 AM  

We use a raised ball joint AFCO part# 20038-1. It has to be welded in.

speedyd1
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 170
posted March 11, 2005 05:49 PM  
20038-1 afco. i believe speedway has them.

speedyd1
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 170
posted March 11, 2005 05:50 PM  
i believe you will need a reamer also.

sbc350
Dirt Full Roller

Total posts: 59
posted March 11, 2005 08:26 PM  
Afco 20038-1 is the same as a moog K6117. Its 3/4" longer than the K6141 but the OD is smaller where it goes in the control arm. Its the balljoint most guys use to raise the front roll center.

crc1124
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 143
posted March 12, 2005 09:27 AM  
I'm considering running these ball joints. Are they just for the lower or do you use an upper one as well? What kind of change am I going to feel when I change to them? I'm running stock ones now. Thanks for any help.

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted March 13, 2005 06:17 PM  
We just added Impala spindles with stock metric lowers. Moog K6145 (tall) bottom ball joints went right in and no reaming. We run screw in uppers K772 (Chrysler) on tube a's, and had to ream them a bit.

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

chip11
Dirt Roller

Total posts: 5
posted March 13, 2005 06:43 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by racin78p:
We just added Impala spindles with stock metric lowers. Moog K6145 (tall) bottom ball joints went right in and no reaming. We run screw in uppers K772 (Chrysler) on tube a's, and had to ream them a bit.


Hey Racin78p,
I also have installed the impala spindles with the stock metric lowers and ub machine tubular a-arms. I went with an 8 inch long arm on the rf and still had to use a ton of shims to get some camber, I was just curious as to what length arms you used and what kind of results you had. Thanks in advance. chip11

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted March 14, 2005 10:54 AM  
Rules say stock GM metric, tube uppers allowed non adjustable. So, they are the stock size. Sorry but I'm not sure what that is right now. The car and I are seperated for the moment so can't messure for you. We haven't aligned the front end up yet, but it is looking good so far. Hope this helps. Race on.

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

hoosier transplant
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 104
posted March 14, 2005 01:04 PM  
Racer78P, what year Impala, and is it a simple exchange. Also, can I run it on the right side only. I have about 10-12 degrees down on the left side but the right side angles up, so when I started to string the frontend the right side starts pointing to the sky. I run after market tublar A-arms. Thanks for any help.

nailngoracing
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 170
posted March 23, 2005 10:04 PM  
how about the moog K6117??

nailngoracing
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 170
posted March 29, 2005 10:07 PM  
how do you like the imca uppers?

do they work well at stock ride height?

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted March 30, 2005 12:33 PM  
Sorry so long to answer Hoosier,... been busy on the car.

The spindles I got were from a 84' Caprice (Impala). I got them because they had the 5" bolt (lug) pattern with 12" rotors. The 4 3/4" lug are 11" rotors. I tried to mount up my stock metric (small) calipers with adapters I got from Jet racing, but wasn't happy with how it was looking, so I am using the big Impala 12" rotors and calipers. I was light in the front anyway so no big deal. I kind of like having extra braking power up front (yes up FRONT) cause I have big Ford drums in the rear. That is another debate but not for right now. I am running the car for the first time this Saturday (play day) and remind me and I will tell how the changes have made what kind of difference. I have been told by many a racer that it is the way to go. I am always looking for something that is better,...

nailnoracing I don't know about the K6117 ball joint, but I DO like the tube uppers. They are stronger, lighter and kick buttocks in my book.

Everyone have a great and SAFE racing season, and as always,...race on.

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

nailngoracing
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 170
posted April 04, 2005 09:15 PM  
did you have to lower your car to use the tubular upper a-arms? becauce they look flatter...a little different from stock?

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted April 05, 2005 08:05 PM  
Okay, the latest.

Got the car to my front end alignment guy, and couldn't get camber and caster like I wanted. Did some messuring and I ordered up 7 1/4" right and 7 1/2" left upper control arms (now bolt in tall ball joints). The stock dimension a-arms wouldn't work. I even went back to the bone yard and got 4 3/4" bolt pattern (11" rotors) and spindles just to be sure they wouldn't cure the caster/camber wooh's. They are the same as 12" (5 on 5 rotors). Anyway, that is where we are at right now. I EXPECT everything to finish out just fine. If I have anymore problems, I'll post to let you all know. Race on.

Nailnoracing: I did adjust my ride height to be a bit lower on the left, just to try to get more camber there. I think I dropped it about a half inch at best. Once i get it scaled, I will know how that effected my numbers, and if it will be a good thing or not. I think it will do, but,...

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

bobaluuu
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 474
posted April 05, 2005 09:52 PM  
somewhere in there I get the feelin this isnt fun anymore but a lot of work. we did all that stuff two years ago and got no faster just more fragile. since then we have backed up to stock stuff only and run stronger and if broken repairs take minutes.
now our mottos "if it cant be fixed in two hours we dont go racin that week" stays fun and cheap and no one gripes to me about not bein home enough..

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Light it up, Baby!

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted April 06, 2005 05:48 PM  
bobaluuu you are correct. It is becoming NOT fun. I started this switch-over process quite some time ago and still the car is NOT on the track. I have missed a special (higher pay-out) show, two practice sessions and two play-days. BUT, I do know that my roll center is higher, and the bump steer has gone ZERO. That is what I am after. So, I will struggle on and get it done. And I will take very good notes so this won't be a problem in the future. And yes, I will share with anyone who needs the info here on this forum. Part of the deal I think! I get the new control arms tomorrow night, and will know pretty fast if this is going to work for sure.

I will let you all know. Race on.

Trying something new and making it work can put you in the front. Change is inevitable. Roll with it.

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

racin78p
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 333
posted April 07, 2005 10:26 PM  
Day Motor Sports sent me the wrong uppers.

I am ready to kill again. It has been a long time since.

The voices say; "Do it, and they will come".

I am going to cut and weld the a arms that I have to the length that I need and get the dumb car on the track this week end. Enough is enough.

I LOVE racing!!!

RACE ON EVERYONE, AND BE SAFE AND PROSPER!!!

Yes, I'll ley everyone know what happens from here.

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racin78p
if it ain't fun, then don't run

gahainsey
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 113
posted April 13, 2005 08:30 AM  
The alignment woes with the 77-90 impala, 73-77 A-body, 70-81 spindles on a metric come from the king pin inclination angle. 7 degrees for metric verus 10 degrees for the big car spindle. ( i think, not sure of exact numbers.) A shorter upper control arm does help alignment . Once you figure out what you need, the big car spindle set up is still easy to repair. I ran the tall balljoint, reamed spindle, welded sleeve with an adapter pressed in set up for two years. Any minor parts replacement was a 5 hour long struggle!Never again!

gahainsey
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 113
posted April 13, 2005 08:33 AM  
Also when talking about Impala spindles, some people think you are referring to the pre 77 big Impala spindles. The tall lower(actually from a mid 70s Chevy truck) ball joint fits the big Impala spindle. The 77 and up Impala spindles are the same as 70-81 camaro, 73-77 A-body spindles. (except for minor differences in weight and outer wheel bearings.

    

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