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Author Topic:   SHORTY BAR
GRTWallbanger
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 196
posted August 08, 2004 03:06 PM  
When you guys talk about running the shorty panard bar?Are you running it from the left side of the pinion to the outside of the frame rail?Or from the left side of the pinion to the inside of the frame?
On our car the difference would be a 18" bar or a 13" Bar.

HIGHVOLTAGE
Dirt Full Roller

Total posts: 47
posted August 08, 2004 07:25 PM  
Run it where you get the best clearence.Ours is only 9 inches long.We also run the lr sping in front of the axle so you just got to get it where it best for you.

GRTWallbanger
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 196
posted August 09, 2004 09:21 AM  
I can run it in either place.Just wondered what was better for more bite and more LF lift?

NJantz
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 755
posted August 09, 2004 10:09 AM  
GRT- you can do it either way. Most guys will have to use the outside of the frame rail because their bar is so short. A 13" bar will be well suited for a dryslick smooth short track.

dirtbuster
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 2007
posted August 09, 2004 12:55 PM  
WE run both. Seems like the longer one is a little smoother to drive. The shorter one is a little twitchier and driver may take some time getting used to it. Also dont go overboard with angle on the shorter one.

GRTWallbanger
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 196
posted August 09, 2004 08:07 PM  
I got about 8 inchs of rake in the 18" bar.1 inch below pinion .To the outside off the frame.Cant seem to get any roll with these american rock tires.
Is this to much?

smayo964
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 194
posted August 12, 2004 05:22 AM  
Not to kick this pig again, but talking with my driver of my old car we feel we need to change our panard bar also. We currently are running a long bar behind the rearend. If we go to a shorty or J-bar, we don't have the room/mounts to hook in front by the pinion. If we go to the rear, we're to close in width to use the existing frame rails. Two questions; 1. If we try to use the bar behind the rearend, has anyone used a plate with bolts/studs welded direclty to the back of the housing/chunk? 2. I keep seeing the numbers fly around about rod length, but what is a good all around length of short rod to use? Thanx in advance.

NJantz
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 755
posted August 12, 2004 06:47 AM  
GRT- you panhard bar sounds high to me. A lower panhard will lower the rear roll center which will make the car rollover more and give you more sidebite. Could the car stand to be tightened up in the middle of the corner?

smayo-
1. haven't ever seen it done but you should try it. might start the next trend.
2. 13.5", but thats just my opinion.

racinruss00
Dirt Newbie

Total posts: 4
posted August 12, 2004 08:32 AM  
quote:
Originally posted by NJantz:
GRT- you panhard bar sounds high to me. A lower panhard will lower the rear roll center which will make the car rollover more and give you more sidebite. Could the car stand to be tightened up in the middle of the corner?

smayo-
1. haven't ever seen it done but you should try it. might start the next trend.
2. 13.5", but thats just my opinion.


SMAYO, yes I have seen this type of set up, and it works really well. The Specialty/J- Mcdonald cars have this set up and are very fast.

Kromulous
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 796
posted August 12, 2004 08:32 AM  
I would think that mounting the short bar closer to the center line of the axles would be easier on the rear-end. I have noticed in the past that our pinion mount brackets bend under rough track conditions due to it being so far out away from the axle cl, basicly giving it a torque arm to bend it.

Mounting the shorty bar closer to the axle center line should give the rearend less of a torque arm to bend the bar or mount.

Now that i think about it, with the mounting point way out in front of the axel, giving the shorty bar a torque arm over the rear end (pivot point will be the hiem on the pumkin side) it may cause some bind in the bird cages under alot of side load. Particuarly if you run some static rear steer or a 4-bar car that really moves.

awesome idea thou, giving me somthing to think about all day hehe.

speedy46
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 165
posted August 12, 2004 08:49 AM  
i have seen one person run a shorty bar on the pumpkin and he has had a load of sucsess it really hooks hard just make sure u have someone good welding it that would **** for it to snap

GRTWallbanger
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 196
posted August 12, 2004 10:21 AM  
NJ?
Do yo mean lower it on the pinion or lower it at the frame?It is 8 inch from the bottom of the frame and 1 inch below the pinion, giving me about 8 inches of rake

smayo964
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 194
posted August 12, 2004 11:28 AM  
Thanx for the input guys. For clarification, this is an old DW4 chassis, which used to be cantalever, converted to swing arm, and then when I got it I engineered a 3-link. I was going to put the panard on the pumpkin originally, but since the mounts were already there, I figured I play with the long bar. I now have a DW8 (3-link and short J-bar) with this car and I like the short setup better. Talked my co-driver into the change and we're going for it. Not to worried about the welding. I'm one heck of fabricator for an office rat. ha-ha-ha-ha.... Appreciate all the info. Going to design new brackets/mounts this weekend.

WPP
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 451
posted August 12, 2004 05:40 PM  
I run a 17inch bar with around 4inches of rake measured today and i can also run a 12inch bar how much rake it too much with a short bar thanks

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