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Author Topic:   ENGINE OIL ALERT!
powerglides
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 374
posted June 24, 2005 05:19 AM  
After 14 years racing we had a camshaft failure after only 5 nights Isky .490 lift hyd stock rockers. The manufacturer told me that our friends over at the EPA changed the law so all engine oil refined after 12/03 for highway use no longer has ZDDP (zinc) for extreme pressure lube. And this is probably why we had the failure. I use Kendall GT-1 and this is why the color changed last year. Their recomendations. Use roller rockers for break in, add 2 cans of General Motors EOS assembly lube for break in and 1/2 can per oil change with the Kendall. I have only found 2 oil with this still in it. Penzoil GTP racing oil, and Valvoline Racing oil but I don't know how much ZDDP it contains. I may be behind the times on this but first I have heard of it.

leapinlizard
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 402
posted June 24, 2005 07:34 AM  
Sounds like a good excuse to get outa giving you a new cam.

dirtbuster
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 2007
posted June 24, 2005 07:56 AM  
I think the reason the kendall changed has more to do with getting bought by another company and is being produced in a different factory. Not necessarily because the zinc is gone.

While its true they have reduced or eliminated zinc in most oils, its still possible to break in a cam without tearing it up. EOS is a good idea but I am not sure Id run it all the time. Valvoline racing and especially the 'not street legal' racing oil would be good recommendations. Also it would be a good idea to take extra precaution during break in. Remove the inner springs if pressure is even questionably high or use low ratio breakin rockers. Dont let it idle too slow even after the 20 minute breaking. Keep the idle up around 2000 for awhile just to make sure lots of oil gets splashed around. Then never let a race engine idle less than 1500, ours never goes below 1700.

powerglides
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 374
posted June 24, 2005 08:07 AM  
They are giving me a new cam. I went over assembly procedures and break in procedure we use with manufacturer. he said that is fine 25 minute break in 5 minutes at 2200, 5 at 2600, 5 at 2000, 5 at 2400, 5 at 2500. But I have never had a race engine idle over 1000-1100 rpm. and before the new epa laws the EOS stood for Engine Oil Supliment. So it was designed to run in the oil

dirtbuster
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 2007
posted June 24, 2005 08:33 AM  
I know what the EOS stands for but I think it was designed as a breakin additive not a long term supplement. That doesnt mean it wouldnt work, but we dont have any trouble with our solid cams that are way more aggressive and lots more spring pressure, and we dont use EOS or any additives. I am also not a big fan of additives on a regualr basis either. I feel if you have a good oil you shouldnt need the adds.

You may get by with a low idle on a small cam like that where its basically stock, but with a big cam, solid lifters, big springs etc, 1000rpm idle would be really hard on the cam and lifters. The only oil the cam gets is thrown off the crank, teh faster you idle it the more oil gets thrown on the cam and thus keeps it lubed better. In all reality there is no reason to idle them that slow, its not like you have to sit in traffic with it driving to work. To each there own but I would bump it up a couple hundred if it were me, even on a somewhat stock cam like that.

[This message has been edited by dirtbuster (edited June 24, 2005).]

brownstone
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 284
posted June 24, 2005 09:10 AM  
We have dealt with Isky for over 20 years with NO flat cams ats all. If they are having problems that surprising they grind a quality cam and have good standards in there process.

If Isky is compaining about the lack of Zinc in the oil then its real.

ispin
Dirt Full Roller

Total posts: 48
posted June 24, 2005 01:16 PM  
Kedall was bought by phillips-conaco and the maker of the OLD gt1 is brad penn. He is making the green oil out of the old kendall factory. It is called Brad penn penngrade comes in 20-50, 50 and 70 weights.

Xtreme12x
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 874
posted June 24, 2005 02:07 PM  
I have not had any problems using Napa 20w/50 racing oil (Made by Valvoline)... When I built my motor, I made sure to apply plenty of Cam lube to the camshaft, and bottom of the lifters. As soon as it fired I took the idle up to 2500-3000 and let it run there for 20 minutes with a quick rev here or there. I did not take the inner springs out, or use low ratio rockers. I did add a bottle of EOS to the oil along with a bottle of STP. I use STP religiously in my engines (Or the Napa Oil Treatment), it is cheap insurance. One bottle of EOS should be enough to load the oil with plenty of zinc. Another problem I have seen is the radius on some of the lifters. When I ordered my cam from Charles at Camcraft he strongly suggested ordering the lifters that he sells to go along with his camshafts. I couldn't be more happier with the results so far.

I have no Idea if the Napa Oil still has Zinc in it or not, but I do idle my motor at around 1250-1500,,, Another thing is EDM Lifters, if they make a hydraulic lifter in that style anyways. Sounds like you just had a bad cam. It happens sometimes, the cam grinders really don't have a whole lot of control on some things...

rrrrick
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 192
posted June 24, 2005 03:52 PM  
I used to use standard oil to break the engines in, then change to racing oil.
However, due to the changes in Automobile engine oil, I use diesel engine oil for my break ins. Most diesel oil still has Zinc, sulfer in it and a high detergent.


pbrcowboy2
Dirt Freak

Total posts: 380
posted June 24, 2005 03:56 PM  
we use 20-50 non-street legal racing valvoline it still has zinc its cheap and easy to find

rrrrick
Dirt Maniac

Total posts: 192
posted June 27, 2005 12:42 PM  
found this on another site, interesting about the zinc additive http://www.ford-trucks.com/article/idx/4/141/article/Snake_Oil__Is_That_Additive_Really_A_Negative.html

stockcar5
Dirt Forum Champ
Total posts: 578
posted July 02, 2005 03:13 PM  
alot of 'camshaft" failures the past few years have really been caused my lifters. lotsa cheaply made lifters flaoting around out there. call camcraft or crower and get their good edm lifters. you wont ever have a problem again.

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